FireHead Posted January 7, 2008 Report Share Posted January 7, 2008 hahaha....Megasquirt does the same shit and is easier to use for about $400... motec is a high dollar knockoff of your average factory programming. A megasquirt system is compiled from a myriad of mid-'90's GM EFI parts, plus you get to really screw yourself even harder because you pretty much build it yourself, or buy one someone else made. The only really unique thing about it is the open source software that it runs on. There are several limitations of these systems however, that make it not suitable for use in high rpm engine. First, the common sampling limitation of the processor will only support a maximum effective redline of 11750rpm. Second, the injector pulse width supported by the drivers on the ECM and injectors themselves does not support a large displacement engine or and engine that has to twice as many injection events as the engine type it was originally designed for (2 stroke vs. 4 stroke). Finally, the thing that really drives me nuts about these systems is that the injectors drivers on the ECM are not on protected circuits, so any electrical issues in the system burn up the drivers, which make you by a new ECM. All of that makes it not the best choice for a Banshee engine, unless of course that it is all you are familiar with, but even then, you limit yourseld to what you can do with that engine when using one. The MoTEC systems are nothing like an OEM FIS system. The software is is completely different (onboard and on-bench), the hardware is completely different, and it really isn't a knock-off of anything..........so, come on, how about we stop making stuff up here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE358BANSH Posted January 7, 2008 Report Share Posted January 7, 2008 In my experience, everything that Firehead said would be true. You can play with the PWM's to have a dual injection events or control a huge, piddling injector. But, if your trying to do any fine tuning, there's no point 'cuz it's only a 12X12 table whereas most other system will be at least 16X16 table. And as for Motec, it's the shiznit. IMO, Megasquirt can be a good learning tool to experiment on, but if you want to get serious, your only as good as your hardware... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burleybanshee Posted January 7, 2008 Report Share Posted January 7, 2008 I think the point to 50K busa bike should be you are going to drop a lot of money trying to create a new creature. DSSA, if you are really in the industry, then you know that it is not as easy as you make it out to sound. I know they went form a 6 speed tranny to a four speed tranny and finally to a 3 speed tranny. They had so much power it would just eat up the gears, They ended up with three speeds filling the same space as 6 trying to strengthin it. The real cost is in R & D and replacing all the broken parts that didn't work and they had to modify or come up with something else. The went trough 3 axles, two of which were very expensive titanium. They also have a stack of tires that they purchased trying to find the right diameter, paddle hieghts, and number of paddles. They offered to let me ride it and I told them they could shove it up there ass to, I like myself to much to jump on that beast. They ran it up the dirt drive and tim got on it half throttle and it was amazing. It completely laid over all the paddles and ripped a few off. When that quad tranny was right and everything was dialed in, nothing, repeat nothing could touch that quad. Problem was, it only ran well a couple of times and they could not get the tires to hook up, Tim was never fully in the throttle on his runs. The bike would do much better on pavement. The bike was made to say they had the fastest bike, plain and simple. It wasn't for a customer. Roger sold it for a big loss. The new owners are probably still working out the bugs of the tranny and reprogramming the fuel system to come on slower. If Fireball was to build another one, which I highly doubt, the second turbobusa quad would be less to build because they have already worked out a lot of the bugs. Point being, if you want to spend the money and time to see if it will work then go for it. Let us know how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheeblue01 Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 Why don't you just put a Nitrous kit on it? My shee will eventually get a nitrous kit.. I think it will be the easiest and most reliable setup when it comes to a "power adder" on a banshee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meanv10 Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 Dono if anyone has ever heard that nitrous is a "poor mans turbo" forced induction and nitrous do in theory the same thing. turbos superchargers and nitrous all put more air into the motor. I say just put nitrous on it, maybe a turbo but a supercharger is a little out of the question in my own opinion. A supercharger has a parasitic affect on the moter,because it needs to be spun by it. also a banshee makes most of its power at high rpms unlike a supercharger. bottem line is Superchargers are good at making power for low to mid rpms and turbos are good for high rpm. plus i don't think you could find that small of a centrifugal supercharger. dono could be wrong but that's my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sa3ood_banshee Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 hey guyz my dad used to have this on his harley,and i was wondring if it would fit a shee,btw i have no clue what is this,so plz dnt bash me 4 nothng clicky sa3ood Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRed350x Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 hey guyz my dad used to have this on his harley,and i was wondring if it would fit a shee,btw i have no clue what is this,so plz dnt bash me 4 nothngclicky sa3ood Looks like some kind of a ram-air setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboBanshee420 Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 A megasquirt system is compiled from a myriad of mid-'90's GM EFI parts, plus you get to really screw yourself even harder because you pretty much build it yourself, or buy one someone else made. The only really unique thing about it is the open source software that it runs on. There are several limitations of these systems however, that make it not suitable for use in high rpm engine. First, the common sampling limitation of the processor will only support a maximum effective redline of 11750rpm. Second, the injector pulse width supported by the drivers on the ECM and injectors themselves does not support a large displacement engine or and engine that has to twice as many injection events as the engine type it was originally designed for (2 stroke vs. 4 stroke). Finally, the thing that really drives me nuts about these systems is that the injectors drivers on the ECM are not on protected circuits, so any electrical issues in the system burn up the drivers, which make you by a new ECM. All of that makes it not the best choice for a Banshee engine, unless of course that it is all you are familiar with, but even then, you limit yourseld to what you can do with that engine when using one. try convincing bruce or al of these lies on the megasquirt forum.... I'd love to see that. You can throw this crap around on the HQ, but you should try it where people actually know these systems intimately. Half the things you said here aren't even close.... like... "First, the common sampling limitation of the processor will only support a maximum effective redline of 11750rpm." The 36-1 wheel I'm using has been tested past 20k rpm. so 20k rpm times 36 teeth.... what's the sample rate there? And besides dude, my bike is proof that it works fine with a 2 stroke... and a turbo.... all the way to my 12,500rpm limit. Be at quadfest in july and i'll prove it to you. bottom line..... don't knock it til' you've tried it. And if you have and you found a set-up by some miracle that hasn't been done before, megasquirt will eat it up with room for seconds. www.msefi.com start reading firehead, then I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on stuff like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueshee03 Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 hey guyz my dad used to have this on his harley,and i was wondring if it would fit a shee,btw i have no clue what is this,so plz dnt bash me 4 nothngclicky sa3ood lol,thats known as a hyper charger. the only real power gain comes from the k&n filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPEN Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 I think the point to 50K busa bike should be you are going to drop a lot of money trying to create a new creature. DSSA, if you are really in the industry, then you know that it is not as easy as you make it out to sound. I know they went form a 6 speed tranny to a four speed tranny and finally to a 3 speed tranny. They had so much power it would just eat up the gears, They ended up with three speeds filling the same space as 6 trying to strengthin it. The real cost is in R & D and replacing all the broken parts that didn't work and they had to modify or come up with something else. The went trough 3 axles, two of which were very expensive titanium. They also have a stack of tires that they purchased trying to find the right diameter, paddle hieghts, and number of paddles. They offered to let me ride it and I told them they could shove it up there ass to, I like myself to much to jump on that beast. They ran it up the dirt drive and tim got on it half throttle and it was amazing. It completely laid over all the paddles and ripped a few off. When that quad tranny was right and everything was dialed in, nothing, repeat nothing could touch that quad. Problem was, it only ran well a couple of times and they could not get the tires to hook up, Tim was never fully in the throttle on his runs. The bike would do much better on pavement. The bike was made to say they had the fastest bike, plain and simple. It wasn't for a customer. Roger sold it for a big loss. The new owners are probably still working out the bugs of the tranny and reprogramming the fuel system to come on slower. If Fireball was to build another one, which I highly doubt, the second turbobusa quad would be less to build because they have already worked out a lot of the bugs. Point being, if you want to spend the money and time to see if it will work then go for it. Let us know how it goes. Most valuable post right here IMO.. So many people forget what it can REALLY take to build something that off the wall.. I wouldn't be suprised if there are quite a few parts on that bike that had to be straight up custom made.. As for the subject at hand.. Believe it or not, I have actually seen a vid on-line a couple years back that was a supercharged banshee.. The video quality wasn't the greatest but the bike didn't sound that good at all.. The site I found this at almost looked like some small timers trying to get a buisness specializing in this off the ground.. I just searched for it a few minutes ago but didn't find anything.. Ill keep looking as I know that there are probably several thinking Iam full of shit.. i just remember thinking, "man thats a weird idea"..lol Again it didn't sound like it worked very well and I believe it would be retarded difficult to make it work even close to right.. But for the few that say its IMPOSSIBLE are simply wrong.. RIPPEN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboBanshee420 Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 anyone remember the "stratocharger" was in dirtwheels a bunch of years ago. It was basically a fan wheel on the flywheel of a 250r. Supposedly it made another 10hp with this thing on there. (dyno sheets were printed) the airbox pressure made it just over 3.5psi. It was something else alright...hehe.... but it worked. Anyone can do anything if they research it enough and have the means to make it happen. I'm not one to shoot people down with their ideas. A supercharger is a power robber yes, but I bet i could take a t-3 turbo and cut it in half.... slap a 75:1 gearbox on it and call it a supercharger...... alittle pulley action and voila! SUPERBANSHEE Anyone heard of the superbeast? They told him he couldn't do it either, but he has a 4-71 on his v-force. And he's the fastest quad up the hill in every vid he has. youtube......metalalien streetshee.... Go for it man!!! don't let these guys get you down with their cliche' "monoblock" "nitrous" crap. That's for ameteurs! BTW.... there is a guy with a turbo busa z-450 on youtube already. search "turbo quad" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireHead Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 try convincing bruce or al of these lies on the megasquirt forum.... I'd love to see that. You can throw this crap around on the HQ, but you should try it where people actually know these systems intimately. Half the things you said here aren't even close.... like... "First, the common sampling limitation of the processor will only support a maximum effective redline of 11750rpm." The 36-1 wheel I'm using has been tested past 20k rpm. so 20k rpm times 36 teeth.... what's the sample rate there? And besides dude, my bike is proof that it works fine with a 2 stroke... and a turbo.... all the way to my 12,500rpm limit. Be at quadfest in july and i'll prove it to you. bottom line..... don't knock it til' you've tried it. And if you have and you found a set-up by some miracle that hasn't been done before, megasquirt will eat it up with room for seconds. www.msefi.com start reading firehead, then I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on stuff like this. Yeah, I have tried what your talking about. In fact, I might know a couple things about FIS. However, if you would like to bring one of your buddies over here to have a technical discussion about FIS, bring 'em on..........I bet I can make you and them look silly. Also, if you don't know which GM processor you are using.......................I am pretty sure you don't know much about what you are doing besides crimping some wires together and hoping that it works. :thumbsup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboBanshee420 Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 ....right..... make sure you put some grease fittings on your helmet now so you can fit that big head in there still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billybobby Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 I have to agree with Turbo hooray for all of you who are so much smarter then everyone else . If you can't get any nanny in the real world what makes you think telling some dude online that your chit don't stink is going to get you any. I submit that the Busa shee is a bad ride and 50 G's is in no way out of the question. Fire head maybe someday the award of smartest feller on the HQ will be yours. Turbo keep us updated on the shee. When you get her up to speed I may be first to pick your brain on a mega squirt kit for myself or maybe I will talk to the HQ Jesus himself since he tried and failed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireHead Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 I have to agree with Turbo hooray for all of you who are so much smarter then everyone else . If you can't get any nanny in the real world what makes you think telling some dude online that your chit don't stink is going to get you any. I submit that the Busa shee is a bad ride and 50 G's is in no way out of the question. Fire head maybe someday the award of smartest feller on the HQ will be yours. Turbo keep us updated on the shee. When you get her up to speed I may be first to pick your brain on a mega squirt kit for myself or maybe I will talk to the HQ Jesus himself since he tried and failed. Here's my deal.............I wasn't ragging on anyone's project and I certainly think it's neat to see. SandDragon's 'Busa powered shee is awesome. I have seen it in person, and I think that it there isn't much else out there in this sport with that level of engineering and effort put in to it. Now, Turbobanshee on the other hand come off as being an ass, stating things that are not even kind of true, and not contributing anything to this forum...............Of course, I my verbal foot is going up his ass sideways. If anyone wants to have an intelligent discussion about anything, then I'm always down for that, I just have low tolerance for weirdo's passing stuff they made off as fact on the internet. :thumbsup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.