BluBanshee98 Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Well I plan to start my hillshooter project soon but cannot decide which motor I would like to do. I've never owned a cub. My last banshee was a 4mil stock jug dune port. Just looking for pro's and cons of all motors and see if any of you can chime in on roughly how much power I can look for out of these different combinations. I plan on K&T doing the machine work. This is not going to be a comp bike. Just something for the weekend to go out and shoot the hill and win some. I understand money will be one of the main things that separates these builds but if its reasonably more for more hp then it will just take a little longer to finish the build. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncbob Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 The more you build it, the more it's going to cost you, in machine work, and parts you have you have to buy to hold up to the engine you plan on building. Speed cost money, how fast do you want to go?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
278 Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 "Speed cost money, how fast do you want to go?? " this is one of the best gear head sayings in my opinion. The 10 mil. super cub is going to make the most power, however it is the most expensive, and you will spend some serious money on it. If you have the money go for it though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluBanshee98 Posted February 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 "Speed cost money, how fast do you want to go?? " this is one of the best gear head sayings in my opinion. The 10 mil. super cub is going to make the most power, however it is the most expensive, and you will spend some serious money on it. If you have the money go for it though LOL I figured I'd probably hear this! Maybe I should have rethought my post. I have been turning wrenches for some time now and know speed is extremely expensive! I was looking for the opinion of someone who might have run a few of these motors. There comes a point where reliability goes away and it becomes more of a job than a hobby or sport. I may just stay with a smaller machine and when I get spanked a few times and want to go faster I'll tear it down and build it bigger. I think this method is more cost effective for someone who isn't loaded! Thanks anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
locogato11283 Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 i have a 10mm cub thats been bulletproof for 4 years. tons of power and very rideable. i had a 4mm cub before that and the 10mm definitely has a good power increase. if youre going to go 7mm, you might as well go 10mm because the cost is the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firebanshee Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 (edited) You can put together a 421 cub with no machine work just cut domes and you can do it all yourself. You don't even need to port them, they haul ass right out of the box, just put good bearings on a 4mil crank and have it welded.You can even run stock style cool heads with big bore domes 68mil. In my opinion get a duneable override and drop it all in and go. The money you will save on machine work will buy your trans and a lockup clutch.You start making alot of power with a banshee and they become hard to shift without a good trans. A duneable override is one of the best mods you can do. Alot of people run them and without one you would be at a hudge disadvantage. Just my 2 cents. Edited February 6, 2010 by firebanshee 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluBanshee98 Posted February 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 Loco and Fire....Thank you both! These are the kind of answers I was looking for. I have found I can pick up the crank, jugs, and pistons for around $2300 on the 520 super cub. I have not talked to a machine shop yet to find out what I would have in machine work on top of this. If I can build this motor and have it be somewhat reliable then I'll just cut to the chase and build this super cub. A buddy of mine lives close to K&T and was gonna stop by for me and get a price for a 421 and the Super Cub. I also agree about a good transmission and clutch setup. The guy with the override is gonna walk away from you each time you are trying to power shift with a normal setup when shooting up the hill. How many have made the 100hp mark with a 421? Very good information. Keep them coming. Hopefully everyone's info in this post will help others trying to decide on a build. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XxMeltIcexX Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 I havn't owned a 10 mil supercub, but from what I've heard I wouldn't go past a 4 mil supercub. The reason being is that the intake size remains the same as stock, and for that size of motor it would really benefit from a larger intake (in that case go for a cheetah). I have a 421 cub fully ported, and let me tell you it will flat out make you grin if you are going from a 4 mil stock cylinder to a fully ported 4 mil cub. If I were to do it over again, I would have gone with a 10 mil for the money. EDIT: My 421 hasn't been dyno'd but from what my builders done for a few people I know with these motors, I wouldn't doubt 110 hp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheefreak Posted February 6, 2010 Report Share Posted February 6, 2010 10 mil cub is my vote. The 72 mm piston cost twice as much as the 68 and there won't be that big a power difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluBanshee98 Posted February 7, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2010 (edited) Does anyone have any dyno sheets from these different motors? I think that if I could make over a 100hp with a 421 I'd be happy. I read and RDZ claim 106hp out of an unported 421! However if I can make 30hp or so more then it would be worth going to the 10mil 520! Does anyone else have input on the intake size of the cub to the cheetah? Does it make that much of a difference? Thanks Edited February 7, 2010 by BluBanshee98 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
locogato11283 Posted February 7, 2010 Report Share Posted February 7, 2010 i wouldnt get so wrapped up with dyno numbers, after all, they are just numbers. they can also be manipulated to say whatever you want them to say.. i personally would not build a supercub motor. if you do, i definitely would not build the 10mm super cub. the intakes are too small for the amount of air needed to run the motor efficiently. if youre dead set on a super cub, go with the 4mm.. however, i would seriously consider just building the 10mm cub and be done with it. it will make 100hp easy on gas even. the 4mm cub can make big power numbers, but you will need to look into outframe pipes and alcohol. ive had both the 4mm and 10mm cub. the power increase on the 10mm is very noticeable. ive never had it dynoed and dont need to. the difference is there. ive been racing against a 10mm supercub for the last couple race seasons and im not impressed with it. me with my 10mm cub and my brother with his 4mm cub consistently beat up on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluBanshee98 Posted February 7, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2010 i wouldnt get so wrapped up with dyno numbers, after all, they are just numbers. they can also be manipulated to say whatever you want them to say.. i personally would not build a supercub motor. if you do, i definitely would not build the 10mm super cub. the intakes are too small for the amount of air needed to run the motor efficiently. if youre dead set on a super cub, go with the 4mm.. however, i would seriously consider just building the 10mm cub and be done with it. it will make 100hp easy on gas even. the 4mm cub can make big power numbers, but you will need to look into outframe pipes and alcohol. ive had both the 4mm and 10mm cub. the power increase on the 10mm is very noticeable. ive never had it dynoed and dont need to. the difference is there. ive been racing against a 10mm supercub for the last couple race seasons and im not impressed with it. me with my 10mm cub and my brother with his 4mm cub consistently beat up on it. This is good to know. I plan on doing out of frame pipes but don't feel like dealing with alky right now. I agree that dyno number are just numbers but it gives a little room for comparison given that they haven't been manipulated. The cub definitely sounds like a better choice over the super. The 10mil seems like the best bang for the buck when it comes down to comparison! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brave&crazy racing Posted February 7, 2010 Report Share Posted February 7, 2010 i have had both 4 mill cub and 10 mill cub and 4 mill stock cyl. motors all done by a&s. now keep in mind all my motor were drag ported motor on alky.. if it were me i would do the 10mill. imo. my 4 mill has a fun motor in the woods. there is not a lot of cost different in the motors the top end will all run the same. the tq will be a little better on the 10.. and it will be more forgiving over all.. pipes go with cpi. i run Shearer Pipes on my cubs. i feel cpi have my low end for the hill.. carbs cant go wrong with 39 pwk for eather the 4 or the 10. i would go with alky. its not as hard as you may think. and is ez to read plugs. just start with .120k main and a 55 will end up at a 118k. that is the drill bit size not the # on the main jet. run the billet bowls or a black mic. pump. stay with the 68mm pistons too. that way you can use all stock banshee reeds and the standered banshee heads or cool head noss head what ever.. if you wanted to go bigger look in to a 4 mill dm they are 78mm pistons and a 4 mill would be just over 550cc.. lots of tq and ton more power than the small cubs.. imo i would have a&s or titan racing bild it over k&t. nothing wrong with k&t at all.. i have just seen more out of my titan and a&s motors.. but k&t will get the work done faster.. or you could have denny at flotekperformance.com do the motor. so go with 10cub or a 4 mill dm or last 4 mill cub Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluBanshee98 Posted February 7, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2010 I like the idea of the 10 mil cub for use of parts in a pinch! Good info! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natas Posted February 7, 2010 Report Share Posted February 7, 2010 I'm running a 7mill 443 built by k&t. It pulls hard.go 7 or 10 mill super fun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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