pokeatyou2 Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 what im running with. dmc alien exhaust - dualstage foam filter adaptor plate now with a k&n power lid on - modquad billet intake manifold with built in cross over tube - boyseen dual stage power reeds stock cages - prodesign cool head 21cc domes - advance timing +4 - bored .25 over with wossner lite teflon coated pistons - ok i also got some porting done i actually know the some of the specs of the porting intake was dropped by 8mm and the intake opened alot , the exhaust port was dropped by 3mm and opened to match pipe opening to create the smoothest flow possible into exhuast, im not to sure about the transfer port but i know they were opened down near the crank but not in the cylinder. hope that info helps ok now im up to 27.5 pilot and 370 mains running at sea level at temps 60-90F all these mods done after recent rebuild i did a plug chop and it was about 6mm of coffee color i thought this would be ok i dont mind being a bit rich but this is to rich im thinking was on the sand yesterday and got beat my a stock banshee running t5s no air box lid and kN filter I WAS NOT HAPPY i know my jetting is to rich i have huge amounts of oil on the ends silencers and new plugs after one ride were black as black can be and wet. yesterday was my first day back on the sand after running it in for 2 full days on the dirt i dont mind giving it a big runn in better to be safe then sorry with it being this rich do you reckon i should drop down to 340s just that i have a set of these and go from there? with correct jetting i should be beating him shouldnt i? also it boiled yesterday on a very steep hill climb, can being Way to rich also cause over heating problems? just was very pissed off to have it boil with a cool head on. ANY HELP WOULD BE GREAT THANKS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajogejr Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 6mm is rich on the main....if you used new plugs and held it WOT.... I hope you mean they "raised" the exhaust and intake, not "lowered".... You're rich...but that probably isn't the cause of your overheating.... The bike you raced, what kind of paddles did it have? based on the ones in your sig picture, they suck for drag racing to be honest!! good duners, bad for drag. I'd drop the mains to 340 (since you have them) and do a proper plug chop... http://www.dfn.com/benkaren/plugchop.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pokeatyou2 Posted March 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 6mm is rich on the main....if you used new plugs and held it WOT....I hope you mean they "raised" the exhaust and intake, not "lowered".... You're rich...but that probably isn't the cause of your overheating.... The bike you raced, what kind of paddles did it have? based on the ones in your sig picture, they suck for drag racing to be honest!! good duners, bad for drag. I'd drop the mains to 340 (since you have them) and do a proper plug chop... http://www.dfn.com/benkaren/plugchop.html the guy i raced had the same paddles (roosters) also yes the exhaust was raised(my bad) the plug chop with the 6mm was done properly i will be doing another plug chop with 340s and posting pics but honestly with my jetting correct i should be killing my mate with just t5s and the same paddles? i think so anyways what else could have been the problem for the overheating? it was a very very steep hill very soft sand it was for a standing start that i could only get it into 2nd gear and it was revving it arse off the whole pull and not going very fast so could it have just been a lack of air flow on the radiator also it was about 100F and it was my third attempt at the hill which i didnt make the first 2 times. thanks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snedden9485 Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 daz! i think i know why i beat you. its cause yellow banshees go faster than white ones! il live it up for the short while coz i dont think il win too many more of the drags. i forgot to tell you that i had my bike ported and raised the jets last week........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireHead Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 I would say that your main jet is way rich. The stock'ish motor that I have on my shelf with a prrty mild port job, 17cc dome'ed cool head, VF3 reeds, 30mm bored out stock carbs, Dyna ignition with a custom map, and CPI in-frame pipes only needed a 350 main at sea level, but it also needed a 32.5 pilot. Every motor is different, obviously, and you will certainly need to due some experimentation and plug chop work. If you posted pictures of your plugs after a plug chop, we will probably be able to help you even further. Your paddles suck for an application such as a Banshee. With all that said, your overheating could still be caused by jetting. Just because your main jet is too big, doesn't mean that one of your other circuits is set to be too lean. Like I said above, I needed another size up on the pilot jet. I am not sure about your needle setting. What kind of shape is your coolant in? Have you run the bike with the radiator cap off to make sure that the water pump impeller hasn't taken a dump on you? Do you have a good feeling that you radiator cap is holding pressure? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
locogato11283 Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 370 is way too big. have you dont a WOT plug test just to see what color your plugs are? ive never even done a plug chop. ive always just tuned by plug color and feel of the bike. im thinking you need more around a 330 or 340. your pilot jet should be ok at 27.5. also, what mix of gas and fuel are you running? also, check your coolant level..has it gone down in the radiator? do you still have an overflow? if it hasnt gone down then your jetting may be a cause of it overheating. if the level has gone down you have some pressurizing going on somewhere.. just throwin some ideas out there for you.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireHead Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 also, check your coolant level..has it gone down in the radiator? do you still have an overflow? if it hasnt gone down then your jetting may be a cause of it overheating. if the level has gone down you have some pressurizing going on somewhere.. just throwin some ideas out there for you.. What do you mean by "pressurizing going on somewhere?" Are you referring to the symptoms of a blown head gasket, for example? (I figured if I didn't understand than others might not either) :thumbsup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
locogato11283 Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 What do you mean by "pressurizing going on somewhere?" Are you referring to the symptoms of a blown head gasket, for example? (I figured if I didn't understand than others might not either) :thumbsup: well in this case id be referring to a bad oring since hes got a cool head. ive had it happen before where an oring was broken and the coolant system became pressurized forcing the coolant out the overflow. it was never enough coolant getting into the cylinder to affect engine performance but it would most def push it out the overflow. in fact, i would have never known if i wouldnt have seen the coolant shooting out the overflow tube onto the ground. i dont run coolant bottles on anything.. when i pulled it apart there was a little bit of coolant in the pipes. but like i said, it wasnt enough to affect engine performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireHead Posted March 12, 2007 Report Share Posted March 12, 2007 well in this case id be referring to a bad oring since hes got a cool head. ive had it happen before where an oring was broken and the coolant system became pressurized forcing the coolant out the overflow. it was never enough coolant getting into the cylinder to affect engine performance but it would most def push it out the overflow. in fact, i would have never known if i wouldnt have seen the coolant shooting out the overflow tube onto the ground. i dont run coolant bottles on anything.. when i pulled it apart there was a little bit of coolant in the pipes. but like i said, it wasnt enough to affect engine performance. The theory makes sense........I wasn't picking on you for that. I just wasn't sure if that's what you were getting or if it was something else. I would definitely agree that a combustion pressure leak in to the cooling system could cause his overheating system. I feel a bit retarded since I didn't think of it before. I have quite a bit of experience with the symptoms you describe from back when I was learning how to properly size o-ring grooves in aluminum parts that go through a heat cycle the hard way. :laugh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
locogato11283 Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 The theory makes sense........I wasn't picking on you for that. I just wasn't sure if that's what you were getting or if it was something else. I would definitely agree that a combustion pressure leak in to the cooling system could cause his overheating system. I feel a bit retarded since I didn't think of it before. I have quite a bit of experience with the symptoms you describe from back when I was learning how to properly size o-ring grooves in aluminum parts that go through a heat cycle the hard way. :laugh: haha no i didnt think you were pickin on me.. some people have just never had it happen and trust me it was pretty fuckin irritating until i figured out what it was. swapped the o ring out and it never happened again. had the same type of thing happen in my bros cub motor except it was pressurizing the gear case. a couple bad seals in the water pump area was letting air ( and a little coolant) get by and pushing gear oil right out that overflow in back.. that was a hard one to figure out there.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banchetta Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 (edited) If I was you, I woudln't run wot until you figure out the overheating problem. Banshee don't overheat unless there is a problem...Like loco said, most likely one of the orings is leaking or pinched when you put the head on...Its very common. IF your pushing compression into the coolant, then there is a chance that coolant is getting into the cylinders. Enough coolant or the right placement of water in the middle of the piston will put a hole in the middle of the piston...Happened to JKJK's shee the day after he overheated...So find the problem at hand....It would also explain why you can't climb a hill beyond second gear....There is something severly wrong w/ that....I drag up dunes in 4th gear w/ a 15/38 gear w/ 8 paddle Haulers...Figure out the overheating problem first and work on the jetting next...Rich jetting will NOT create your shee to overheat...A good way to adjust mains is listen and feel how the motor pulls in a drag uphill or at the top of 6th gear. Sand tires rob a lot of hp and jetting is more sensitive and noticeable..the more of a load the easier you can notice the changes..Another good way is to rerace your buddy after a jetting change. If you only lose by 2 quads instead of 5, then your going to the right direction. Keep rejetting until you find the best pull..Your buddy might want to do the same once you get yours done and he's the one losing... :biggrin: Spend a day and both of you can learn from this. Edited March 13, 2007 by Banchetta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
87sheerips Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 haha no i didnt think you were pickin on me.. some people have just never had it happen and trust me it was pretty fuckin irritating until i figured out what it was. swapped the o ring out and it never happened again. had the same type of thing happen in my bros cub motor except it was pressurizing the gear case. a couple bad seals in the water pump area was letting air ( and a little coolant) get by and pushing gear oil right out that overflow in back.. that was a hard one to figure out there.. Damn I bet that was a bitch to diagnose. I agree, check your head bolts. Retorque them first, just to make sure they arent leaking b/c of a loose seal. I also had a head gasket go on me at the dunes, pissed me off I didnt know WTF happened at the time, but experience goes a long way!! I could of reammed on those head bolts and saved the weekend!! Good luck man, overheating issues blow, but a combo of super rich and 100F at 2MPH could easily equal overheat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireHead Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 haha no i didnt think you were pickin on me.. some people have just never had it happen and trust me it was pretty fuckin irritating until i figured out what it was. swapped the o ring out and it never happened again. had the same type of thing happen in my bros cub motor except it was pressurizing the gear case. a couple bad seals in the water pump area was letting air ( and a little coolant) get by and pushing gear oil right out that overflow in back.. that was a hard one to figure out there.. Yeah, my misadventures with o-rings in the head(s) I made were terrible. Depending on which time it was I took the thing apart and put it back together I would get it [ressurizing the cooling system or drinking coolant. I think I may have had a little of both going on at one point. Atleast I was able to figure out what was causing it. Fixing it was whole other deal. You may actually remember my latest transmission oil vomitting episode. It was probably about a year ago. I had routed and rerouted my breather lines many times and oil was still coming out. I tried several different types and weights of oils (which actually got me hooked on Type F ATF, so it wasn't all bad). No matter what I did, as soon as the cases got above 100 degrees F, the thing started puking gear oil. It finally turned out after the problem mysteriously disappeared and reappeared a few time that there was a casting flaw on the edge of the crank seal diameter. That whole episode was fucking gay. With as much of my own stuff I screw up, it's amazing anyone pays me to do what I do for a living. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pokeatyou2 Posted March 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 hey guys thanks for the great advice i dropped the mains down to 340 and i will see how we go im running 32:1 this part u will laugh at though i ripped my head off to check the o rings they all seem ed fine until i had to but it back together and dropped one of the little bastard down the exhuast coolant chamber in the cylinder lol so then i had to take the cylinder of as well to get the bastard out. well will just have to wait till this week end and test it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireHead Posted March 13, 2007 Report Share Posted March 13, 2007 hey guys thanks for the great advice i dropped the mains down to 340 and i will see how we go im running 32:1 this part u will laugh at though i ripped my head off to check the o rings they all seem ed fine until i had to but it back together and dropped one of the little bastard down the exhuast coolant chamber in the cylinder lol so then i had to take the cylinder of as well to get the bastard out. well will just have to wait till this week end and test it again. If you fish around in that water jacket with a 90 degree dental pick I bet you will get it. I would take a shot at that before a went to all the trouble of taking off a cylinder. You may also try standing the bike on it's and seeing if the o-ring falls out with the coolant that runs out. :thumbsup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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