endofitall9 Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 Alright heres the situation my buddy is building a 4 mil stroker.. when he first put it together he used regular pistons but they came up so far he the top ring of the piston would pop out of the cylinder.. he called the local shop and they told him he needed the 795 series piston with the spacer plate..Well he got the pistons before the spacer plate so he went ahead and installed the pistons, just out of curiosity he put the cylinders on, and turned it over, the pistons come up just as far as they would as if the crank was stock.. So that raised the question why is the stroker plate needed? he then installed the head and turned it over and the piston does not hit anything and turns over smooth? So he been calling around and has been trying to get ahold of Jeff to pick his brain but can get no answer..Any of you guys have some answers or similar situations....? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
00tbanshee Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 the 795 piston you don't have to run the spacer plate but the head will have to be cut.the pistons will come out of the cylinders i believe 2mm.what kind of crank did he buy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endofitall9 Posted March 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 See thats the problem I'm no amatuer when it comes to banshee motors but this thing has me stumped..it a 4 mil wiseco he got...the local shop has him all confused and hes taking me down with him...lol with th stock banshee pistons the piston will come so far out of the cylinder that the top ring will pop and get stuck on top of the cylinder. So the shop told him he had to have the 795's he bought those. Now the piston comes up just as far as my stock stroke crank. it is a 4 mil but its all crazy the evryone tells him he needs a plate and the shop said he doesnt but the way the motor is doing its like he doesnt need it I mean he even put the head on without the spacer and the crank turns over fine dosn't hit or anything..This local shop contradicts eveything i say to him and I persoanlly feel they dont know thy're ass fom a hole in the ground..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trex banshee Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 (edited) IF he truly does have a wiseco 4mill stroker with 5mm longer rods then with the 795 series pistons the piston should come out of the jug 2mm with no plate. NOW, you say he bought the 795 series pistons and now the piston comes flush with the deck with no plate...the only thing that can mean is he has a stock stroke crank with 5mm longer rods because all the 795 series pistons do is move the wristpin up 5mm, taking up the longer rod bringing the top of the piston back down. Sounds like to me he got screwed, unless im missing something. Edited March 20, 2008 by trex banshee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endofitall9 Posted March 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 Alright Now were getting somewhere, see the shop also gave him the plate that goes on top of the cylinders instead of the base plate so there is no way to see how far the pistons come up with the spacer plate. Now do you have any clue to how we would be able to establish whether or not it is a 4 mil or if it is just a 5mm and also if it is just a 5 mil rod on a stock stroke would he just be able to run regualar banshee pistons instead of the 795s therefore making the pistons up about farther there for creating a 5 mm stroke? shit this stuff is confusing...just need help figuring it out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trex banshee Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 Alright Now were getting somewhere, see the shop also gave him the plate that goes on top of the cylinders instead of the base plate so there is no way to see how far the pistons come up with the spacer plate. Now do you have any clue to how we would be able to establish whether or not it is a 4 mil or if it is just a 5mm and also if it is just a 5 mil rod on a stock stroke would he just be able to run regualar banshee pistons instead of the 795s therefore making the pistons up about farther there for creating a 5 mm stroke? shit this stuff is confusing...just need help figuring it out ok you kinda lost me about the whole spacer plate at the top of the cylinders, try to explain that a little more. Now when he put it together with the 795 pistons and it came flush with the top of the cylinder did he have a plate at the bottom or top??? anything?? or just gaskets? i believe the part number for the 4mil stroker is H129 and stock stroke is H111(i think) not positive at all on the stock stroke number. Anyways if it IS a stock stroke with 5mm longer rods you have to run the 795 series pistons to put the piston back down in the cylinder and put port timings back to normal. Putting a stock piston on it would not increase stoke because it doesn't go down any furthur, it moves bottom dead center as well as top dead center so therefore not increasing stroke at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trex banshee Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 i was wrong on the part numbers maybe they changed them or i was thinking of something else....their site says the stroker is 4111, stock 4001, stock stroke long rod 4011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endofitall9 Posted March 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 heres how it went down, he called me and asked me if how far my pistons came up on the cylinder and I said the crown comes a little over the top of the cylinder and then he said well mine is doing that also I said well do you have the "base spacer plate" and he said no that they gave him the "head spacer plate" I was like oh never seen that one before..He came down and looked at my topend i pulled my coolhead off and he said that his came up porlly the same as mine..I think that it is just a longrod and that he woudn't need the plate but this shop has him thinkin different. I even told him look that shop buys trinitys port work and put their name on it howmuch could they know...thanks for the crank numbers I just gave him wisecos phone # so hell find out shortly...one more question whats the benefit of a long rod crank? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trex banshee Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 (edited) heres how it went down, he called me and asked me if how far my pistons came up on the cylinder and I said the crown comes a little over the top of the cylinder and then he said well mine is doing that also I said well do you have the "base spacer plate" and he said no that they gave him the "head spacer plate" I was like oh never seen that one before..He came down and looked at my topend i pulled my coolhead off and he said that his came up porlly the same as mine..I think that it is just a longrod and that he woudn't need the plate but this shop has him thinkin different. I even told him look that shop buys trinitys port work and put their name on it howmuch could they know...thanks for the crank numbers I just gave him wisecos phone # so hell find out shortly...one more question whats the benefit of a long rod crank? ok i well then if he ran no base spacer with 795 series pistons but had that spacer on the top of the cylinders and the pistons came flush with the plate then i would say it is a 4mill 5mm long rod. You see the 4mm stroker makes the piston go 2mm further down and 2mm further up the longer rod just takes stress of the piston and rod because it is not at near as steep of an angle like that of a shorter rod. Edited March 20, 2008 by trex banshee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badassbanshee479 Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 do you have any way of measuring the distance the piston travels from top dead center to bottom dead center?? that will tell you for sure what you have. stock banshee cranks will travel 54mm and a 4 mill stroker will travel 58mm. does the piston come out of the cylinder with the 795 pistons and no spacer top and bottom?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooker82 Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 Is the crank welded? Hot Rods told me that they only weld the pins on there 4mill long rod crank. So if it is a Stock Stroke Long Rod crank it shouldnt be welded. When I built my blaster piston 4 mill long rod engine I laid a regular dome on top of the cylinders and rolled the motor over. It would deffinatly lift the dome up. Blaster pistons are shorter but they have more of a flat piston head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inthemail Posted March 21, 2008 Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 interesting. i was just thinking about rebuilding my stock crank with the longer rods meaning i have to run a plate. is this the same stroke as a 4 mil long rod crank with no plate? are both technically 4 mil strokers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonbon Posted March 21, 2008 Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 interesting. i was just thinking about rebuilding my stock crank with the longer rods meaning i have to run a plate. is this the same stroke as a 4 mil long rod crank with no plate? are both technically 4 mil strokers? No you don't run the plate, just the 795 pistons. Your stroke is determined on the crankshaft and not the rods. If your rod is 5mm longer, it will remain the same stroke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inthemail Posted March 21, 2008 Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 (edited) No you don't run the plate, just the 795 pistons. Your stroke is determined on the crankshaft and not the rods. If your rod is 5mm longer, it will remain the same stroke. i see what you mean. hmm. but if you ran the plate and rechambered your head you would gain a longer stroke am i right? Edited March 21, 2008 by inthemail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonbon Posted March 21, 2008 Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 (edited) i see what you mean. hmm. but if you ran the plate and rechambered your head you would gain a longer stroke am i right? Not with just long rods. If your rod is 5mm longer, your piston will come 5mm above the cylinder, and BDC will be 5mm higher in your cylinders. When its a 4mm stroke, your piston goes 2mm lower than stock BDC and goes 2mm higher than stock TDC. Edited March 21, 2008 by bonbon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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