figure8racer7463 Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 O.K. i had some problems shifting the banshee recently and when i pulled the cov er i found the washer and circlip which holds on the idler gear sitting in the bottom of the cover. I bought a new one and also a new shift shaft just because i was already in there and figured why not make sure it is good too. When i went to re-install the idler gear i realized that the groove that the circlip sits in was damaged pretty bad and had bbroken off a little bit towards the outside of the shaft. The circlip will not seat properly and therefore wont stay on under pressure. My question is can the shaft that the idler gear sits on be replaced without splitting the cases? If not could i take it to the local welder who does amazing work and have him spot weld the circlip and washer to the shaft so my idler gear cant come off? I am going to replace the bushing in the idler gear but dont want to tear the whole motor apart right now. I figure if i can either replace the shaft without splitting the cases or have it welded on and it will last me through the summer i will be happy. I realize that welding the washer and circlip on are not the correct way of fixing this but cant afford to have the cases split right now and will probably rebuild the bottom end over the winter months anyway so am not to worried about haveing to replace that shaft that the idler gear sits on at a later date. Let me know what you think and any other possible solutions which are better than welding them on. Thanks!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-Madd Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 That shaft is one of the transmission shafts, so it can't be replaced without splitting the cases. Spot welding may work, others may chime in. I've had a hell of a time with those idler gears. The clip is always off on my 421 when I take the cover off, even with a steel bushing in the gear. On my 14 mil, the clip came off, then the gear came off enough to wedge behind the clutch basket, which broke the clutch hub and shot my lockup through the lexan clutch cover at the starting line at the dragstrip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figure8racer7463 Posted June 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 That shaft is one of the transmission shafts, so it can't be replaced without splitting the cases. Spot welding may work, others may chime in. I've had a hell of a time with those idler gears. The clip is always off on my 421 when I take the cover off, even with a steel bushing in the gear. On my 14 mil, the clip came off, then the gear came off enough to wedge behind the clutch basket, which broke the clutch hub and shot my lockup through the lexan clutch cover at the starting line at the dragstrip. Ouch! Yeah i was lucky that i dont think it messed anything up besides the obvious but we'll see when i get it all buttoined back up. Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figure8racer7463 Posted June 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 Anybody else have an opinion or ideas??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSSSSS! Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 This happened to me for the second time the other day. I am splitting the cases and replacing the shaft. Compared the shaft to another one I have and it appears that the gear just wears the shaft down over time. The clip groove was worn down and the gear had become sloppy on the shaft. It may not get the lubrication it needs being where it is above oil level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlasterKX Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 splitting the cases isnt hard. doesnt take to long ether. just tear her down replace the shaft and do it right the first time. imo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
locogato11283 Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 have that bitch welded on. when you go to tear your motor down one of these days just replace it all. those idler gears are a pain in the ass. my clip has come off before. its a wonder the gear stayed on and didnt tear anything up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onesickcrewcab Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 If you have another shaft already, just tear it apart and fix it. Its not that big of a deal. If not, do as Loco said. Weld it and fix it next time the motor is apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSSSSS! Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 F.A.S.T. has a steel bushing replacement for the idler gear at $15.95 if it's the gear that is worn and not the shaft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toolman Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 (edited) I'm a welder ( 30 years). Welding that shaft is a bad idea not that it can't be done but that shaft is either case hardened or a hard alloy to begin with and could break and cause a real problem. If i was going to do it i would braze it or silver solder it. But then you have heat issues also to deal with. I just had this happen I'm replacing the shaft. Tim Edited June 20, 2009 by toolman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireHead Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 I'm a welder ( 30 years). Welding that shaft is a bad idea not that it can't be done but that shaft is either case hardened or a hard alloy to begin with and could break and cause a real problem. If i was going to do it i would braze it or silver solder it. But then you have heat issues also to deal with. I just had this happen I'm replacing the shaft. Tim My guess is the shaft is carburized......... Which doesn't like being welded either. Providing the groove for the circlip is in good shape, then you can use a split spring washer in place of the snap ring. I have been doing that with a steel bushing pressed into the gear and I have not had any problems in any of my bikes. Whoever said they are paying $15.95 for the bushings ought ot be getting two for that price........... There are several places that sell them for half the price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2twin350s Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 (edited) Years ago we were riding,a buddy starts his shee in the morning and it just jumped in gear and shut off.A emergency in the dirt cover removal revealed that the idler gear clip fell off, and the gear flew off the shaft, broke in 2 and wedged behind the clutch basket. For him to finish the ride, we removed the gear, and reassmebled the bike and he just bump started it the rest of the weekend.Unfortunately for him, the carnage tore up the case where the kicker spring hooked to the cases which required some welding to repair correctly.When I built my wifes shee, same problem.Shaft all messed up and no circlip groove. I have another engine in the basement..Same problem...Yamha Tri-Z engines have the same dumb set-up. After seeing this problem with that idler clip on Banshees, many times...I just thought of something.. Why not take that output/countershaft shaft, chuck that bitch in a drill press, and drill a 1/16th of an inch hole thru the shaft in front of the idler gear washer, and drive a press fit roll pin thru there, or use a stainless steel cotter pin, in front of the idler gear to stop that thing from coming off...... I am going to give it a try.I am pretty sure that Shaft is hollow, even if not, a drill press with a good bit should drill thru there. Just a idea..... HEll I have a old shaft to try it out. If it works...every engine I do with that set-up will get that done from here on out. Even if that crap is new. Edited June 23, 2009 by 2twin350s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figure8racer7463 Posted June 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 THats a great idea on drilling the shaft. Let us know if it works. I went ahead and had the gear welded on the shaft for now. When the season is over i'm going to completely rebuild the bottom end. Just hope it holds that long. THanks Guys. I will have it back for a ride this weekend and will let you know how it holds up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry's Shee Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Had to tear my son's shee all apart cause he flipped it into a deep mudhole. Anyways, when I tore it down I discovered the washer welded to the shaft. No idea how long like that. Guess I'll see if the gear is real sloppy. If it ain't broke I ain't fixxen it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.