pro-yamaha Posted December 2, 2005 Report Share Posted December 2, 2005 I am going to buy both kits, the cheetah for me and the cheetah cub for my friend. What I want to know is how much faster is the cheetah? I am building both bikes with the same set up The main reason that I am asking this Question is becouse the only info that I have on the cheetah is from Trinity and they sale them so their not going to tell me anything bad about them. (just so ya'll know, when I say cheetah i'm talking about the power valve set up that Trinity makes) Dollar for dollar witch one is better? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruko Posted December 2, 2005 Report Share Posted December 2, 2005 Cheetah Power Valve vs Cheetah Cubs.... this should become a lengthy thread.... I have a Cheetah power valve but I have never rode a Cheetah Cub... but this is what I think you will find.... If you are compairing the same size engines just one with power valves and one without they should both have about the same peak horsepower. I'm pretty sure they use the same port design... although the power valve cyl's use bigger reeds so they should be pretty close. The diference will be in the power curve... the power valve engine will have a much smoother power delivery with a broader power band... where as the Cub will have a narrower power band with a sharper peak. The power valves don't give you anymore peak horsepower they give more bottom end and mid range. It makes them much easier to ride... with all the top end power but without the light switch effect of drag porting. So to answer your question the Cheetah shouldn't be any faster. As far as which is better dollar for dollar... it depends on what you allready have and what you want to do with it. The Cubs can use all your stock mounted parts... such as head, reeds, intakes. So if you have a Cool head and V-force reeds allready you can still use them and just switch them over. That will save you some money. Also if all you want to do is drag race... then why would you need more bottom end??? It'll be wide open all the time anyway. But if you don't have all the after market goodies and you want to do more trail riding than racing... the power valve cyl's come with a new head, V-Force reeds and intakes. So yes they cost more but you also get more. Remmeber though I have and love my power valve Cheetah so my opinion may be a little bias, but I think the power valves are well worth the extra money. It gives you the best of both worlds. You can cruise around the trails during the week with your girl friend, and still go racing on the weekend. And dats what I tinks..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNBRAD Posted December 2, 2005 Report Share Posted December 2, 2005 If you already have aftermarket head, intake, reeds etc.. your best bet is the cub. You will have to replace all of that if you go with a cheetah. If your starting a build from scratch and buying all those parts anyway then they cost will be pretty close. As far as how much faster? I can't answer that, really depends on your set-up. You may have full blown cheetah and get smoked by a stock bore/stroke banshee. In a perfect world where all things are equal, the cheetah will make more power. It's up to you to put it all together and make it perform at 100%, cause if it's not, a cub will smoke you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banshee04le Posted December 2, 2005 Report Share Posted December 2, 2005 If you already have aftermarket head, intake, reeds etc.. your best bet is the cub. You will have to replace all of that if you go with a cheetah. 444032[/snapback] The cheetah kit comes with the intake boots, reeds and head...so you could sell your stock aftermarket parts and make up some of the price difference. Word to the rest of what RNBRAD said. I'd go with the cheetah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pro-yamaha Posted December 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2005 I am buying everything new for both bikes, even though I allready have two cool heads and all the dome sizes I also have carbs intake and drag pipes. but i'm not using any of it, everything that were going to buy is new. I am building these bikes for asphalt drag and both bikes are going to run alcohol. Also both bikes are going to run a 7mil, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtm03 Posted December 2, 2005 Report Share Posted December 2, 2005 the big cheetah is going to be faster for sure.... trust me I have first hand experience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malott 1 Posted December 2, 2005 Report Share Posted December 2, 2005 It is cheaper to build a cub then a cheetah. The only time you need to go to the cheetah is above the 10mm, the 10mm cub actually makes about 4 Hp more than the bigger cheetah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broke Posted December 3, 2005 Report Share Posted December 3, 2005 It is cheaper to build a cub then a cheetah. The only time you need to go to the cheetah is above the 10mm, the 10mm cub actually makes about 4 Hp more than the bigger cheetah. 444247[/snapback] Would that stand to reason that the big reed conversions don't show much benefit until you step up to the larger strokers? I'm just asking, it just kind of adds up that the Cub making more power(in the case) than the Cheetah, really negates the 250 reeds on anything smaller than the 10mil, which I'm going to guess is somewhere around 500cc give or take depending on bore. It's kind of like asking the difference between standard Banshee jugs and RZ jugs. As far as top end power goes they are just about even with the nod toward the Banshee jugs at the top level of performance, but the PV of the RZ jugs make it so a psuedo drag/dune port can be trail ridden with little effort. I am speaking from experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtm03 Posted December 5, 2005 Report Share Posted December 5, 2005 yeh the cubs are cheaper, but you gotta pay to play. there is no reason the cubs would be faster than the big cheetah, other than if the builder didnt know what he was doing. remember the old saying "theres no replacement for displacment" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malott 1 Posted December 6, 2005 Report Share Posted December 6, 2005 yeh the cubs are cheaper, but you gotta pay to play. there is no reason the cubs would be faster than the big cheetah, other than if the builder didnt know what he was doing. remember the old saying "theres no replacement for displacment" 445358[/snapback] Dan Hull from A&S is who told me to stick to a cub unless I was going over 10 mill. I have a feeling he knows what he's talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reded Posted December 6, 2005 Report Share Posted December 6, 2005 You should prolly go with that feeling F.A.S.T 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtm03 Posted December 6, 2005 Report Share Posted December 6, 2005 (edited) thats his opinion, and he is entitled to it....but Ill put my 4 mil cheetah up against any 4 mil cub anyday, shoot bring out the 7 mil cubs....I dont care what numbers are put up on the dyno. what counts is what happens on the hill Edited December 6, 2005 by dtm03 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtm03 Posted December 6, 2005 Report Share Posted December 6, 2005 talk to calvin @ cp. he'll tell you what the deal is. I believe he said the cubs were a good cheaper way to make power, but with all things being equal (builder and rider knows how to tune and ride, etc.) the big cheetah will always outperform the cub Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docbones Posted December 7, 2005 Report Share Posted December 7, 2005 I got a 421 cheetah powervalve. All I can tell you is I rode it over Thanksgiving for the first time and I walked away very impressed. My buddy has a high compression 377 banshee and at Dumont he wanted to see how it would do up their largest hill. Enough said when I got off the throttle he was at least 15 lengths behind!!!! No competition at all!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malott 1 Posted December 7, 2005 Report Share Posted December 7, 2005 their is some good info about this topic on planet sand. A couple of posts about stock cylinders vs aftermarket and in the dyno section. I copied a post that calvin and another person states about the cub and cheetah. Malott has forwarded a link to a post entitled 'Re: 14 mil cubs' on 'Planet Sand Forums'! The post is below. You have received a notification about this post from Malott: The actual post is below </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> The Cub is a "less expensive" way to get good power, if you already have some of the pieces, like an aftermarket head, reeds and manifolds for big carbs, it will be the cheaper way to go. You will notice that I didn't say it will be the best running way to go. The Cubs are running very good, but the big Cheetah will put out better numbers than the Cub. If you need to buy the head, reeds, manifolds, anyway....the cost is pretty close to the same to go with the Big Cheetah or the Cub. <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> I couldn't agree more Calvin. From what I've seen, when you get to a +10mm stroke, the big cheetahs really start to shine over the cubs. I know there are a bunch of good dyno number claims on 10mil cubs, but what are they actually running at the track? Scotty2hottys made 133hp and ran 3.88 at 84mph. Not bad at all. But for comparison sake, look at Triple's son's bike, it's a +9mm big Cheetah with 74.5mm bore (549cc). It runs consistant low 3.70's at 87mph with Donnie riding it, and with Seth's 260lb butt on it, it still runs 3.90's at 87mph. Triple also had a +10mil big cheetah 73mm bore (535cc) 2 years ago that ran consistant low 3.70's. I think 3.80's for 10mil cubs is about right on. When you start talking about 14 and 16mils, the cubs won't do what the big cheetah will. What's the saying "no replacement for displacement". That kinda applies here. View this topic on the web at http://www.planetsand.com/ubbthreads/showt...p?Number=385742 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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