DSSA Posted August 29, 2007 Report Share Posted August 29, 2007 (edited) Not to piss on your parade, but if you're the type of domestic-guy (car-wise) that's into stump-pulling-torque, a two-stroke is NOT the way to go. You're not going to get it with this motor--especially on this budget. Edited August 29, 2007 by DSSA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSSA Posted August 29, 2007 Report Share Posted August 29, 2007 Not to piss on your parade, but if you're the type of domestic-guy (car-wise) that's into stump-pulling-torque, a two-stroke is NOT the way to go. You're not going to get it with this motor--especially on this budget. 91tsiawd on the forum says: "die" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopczynski Posted August 29, 2007 Report Share Posted August 29, 2007 Not to piss on your parade, but if you're the type of domestic-guy (car-wise) that's into stump-pulling-torque, a two-stroke is NOT the way to go. You're not going to get it with this motor--especially on this budget. I did it, and I did it with "This Motor". My acceleration times on the dyno where some of the fastest the dyno had ever seen too. BTW the PT low-mids on a 4 mill jsd stroker made power to 10,500rpm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSSA Posted August 29, 2007 Report Share Posted August 29, 2007 I did it, and I did it with "This Motor". My acceleration times on the dyno where some of the fastest the dyno had ever seen too. BTW the PT low-mids on a 4 mill jsd stroker made power to 10,500rpm. And you think that is low-end torque?? I mean, I know that phrase is a subjective term, but c'mon now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajogejr Posted August 29, 2007 Report Share Posted August 29, 2007 Sell your bike, buy a 4 stroke....make it easy on yourself. Great suspension, gobs of tourque... Snop is right, you can make one torquey....but you can also make the local neighborhood crack whore a prom queen, just too much work.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
06BaNsHeE Posted August 29, 2007 Report Share Posted August 29, 2007 I'm in the process of building a Banshee from the frame up. I'm not at all worried about horsepower numbers, what I want is torque. All that will be done to the motor is stock bore and stroke with Wiseco's, cool head with 22cc domes, Toomey T-5 complete system, Toomey filter, stock carbs tuned for filter and pipes, I think that's about it... What I wanna know is what are the best choices for replacement reeds for bottom end torque and what can I do to get more bottom end out of my combination? I'm planning on heavy trail riding so again, horsepower numbers are useless to me, I need torque. I know that I won't get much torque out of a 2-stroke but I'd like to be able to get as much as possible... Trade it for a honda 450 or yfz or even a 400 and be done with it in my opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopczynski Posted August 29, 2007 Report Share Posted August 29, 2007 And you think that is low-end torque?? I mean, I know that phrase is a subjective term, but c'mon now... I am trying to remember when I told you where those pipes started making power and what kind of numbers they made. Oh, thats right I didn't, I only told you where they stopped making power. I have a very torquey bike, that makes very broad power, and it starts making it hugely at around 2500-3000rpm. Its not hard to do either, most of the parts you buy to do it are cheaper than your tradional banshee hp parts. The port work is cheaper, the carb setup is cheaper, the reeds are cheaper, and most of all a 2 into 1 pipe is cheaper than twin pipes. Get real, the guy is not going to sell his bike to get a 4 stroke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigblockbanshee Posted August 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2007 (edited) I think you're probably right. You know maybe I'll just get rid of the banshee and be like everyone else that wants to do it the easy way and just go buy a thumping 4 stroke off the showroom floor with a warranty and every piece will be brand new. Ya I'll do that as soon as I come across about 8 grand because if I can find a good 4 stroke that doesn't cost that much it'd take the rest of the money to make it run anywhere close to a banshee. Heck by then I'd have about one of the fastest and quickest banshee's around my area if I put that kind of money into mine... Seriously though, if anyone has ever built a machine from the ground up then you know that there's a sense of pride that comes with the completion of the project. I don't think I'll ever get rid of my Banshee. If any of the 4 stroke guys haven't heard, they don't make Banshees anymore. I guess you could say maybe they are kind of a collector item now, that was my main reason for wanting one and finally being able to get one. The more I think about it I think I'll just put it back bone stock. Heck I may be dissatisfied but I can tune my riding skills to the Banshee instead of trying so hard to tune the Banshee to me. I'm very much a domestic-car guy, I drag race a '68 Camaro and I drive a Ford truck (twisted isn't it), I can't say that I really believe in anything else when it comes to automobiles. But as far as atv's and such, the way things are nowadays you're just retarded if you don't buy a foreign made atv/bike. They're lighter, quicker, faster, and overall much more durable and competitive than American makes. I've come to realize that after owning a Polaris... As far as the gas buildup after your rebuild, I can understand that. But I do know that due to federal and state emissions laws mandate that the same fuel will be mixed numerous ways to comply with a certain states regulations. With that said, I can see your point. The buildup I was talking about was actually on one of my race motors in my Camaro. I'll never run pump gas again simply for that one incident I had with the gas. Oddly enough that motor only had bout a hundred miles on it.... Oh well. Keep it coming!!! And as far as pissing on my parade, don't worry bout it. My parade is still a bare frame with boxes upon boxes of parts laying around hahaha... And on an ending note, I cannot believe a banshee owner suggested that I trade it for a 4 stroke, you should be ashamed... Edited August 30, 2007 by bigblockbanshee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopczynski Posted August 30, 2007 Report Share Posted August 30, 2007 And on an ending note, I cannot believe a banshee owner suggested that I trade it for a 4 stroke, you should be ashamed... Ditto! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smuttdawg Posted August 30, 2007 Report Share Posted August 30, 2007 Damn Dude ,tell us how you really feel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajogejr Posted August 30, 2007 Report Share Posted August 30, 2007 I think you're probably right. You know maybe I'll just get rid of the banshee and be like everyone else that wants to do it the easy way and just go buy a thumping 4 stroke off the showroom floor with a warranty and every piece will be brand new. Ya I'll do that as soon as I come across about 8 grand because if I can find a good 4 stroke that doesn't cost that much it'd take the rest of the money to make it run anywhere close to a banshee. Heck by then I'd have about one of the fastest and quickest banshee's around my area if I put that kind of money into mine... Seriously though, if anyone has ever built a machine from the ground up then you know that there's a sense of pride that comes with the completion of the project. I don't think I'll ever get rid of my Banshee. If any of the 4 stroke guys haven't heard, they don't make Banshees anymore. I guess you could say maybe they are kind of a collector item now, that was my main reason for wanting one and finally being able to get one. The more I think about it I think I'll just put it back bone stock. Heck I may be dissatisfied but I can tune my riding skills to the Banshee instead of trying so hard to tune the Banshee to me. I'm very much a domestic-car guy, I drag race a '68 Camaro and I drive a Ford truck (twisted isn't it), I can't say that I really believe in anything else when it comes to automobiles. But as far as atv's and such, the way things are nowadays you're just retarded if you don't buy a foreign made atv/bike. They're lighter, quicker, faster, and overall much more durable and competitive than American makes. I've come to realize that after owning a Polaris... As far as the gas buildup after your rebuild, I can understand that. But I do know that due to federal and state emissions laws mandate that the same fuel will be mixed numerous ways to comply with a certain states regulations. With that said, I can see your point. The buildup I was talking about was actually on one of my race motors in my Camaro. I'll never run pump gas again simply for that one incident I had with the gas. Oddly enough that motor only had bout a hundred miles on it.... Oh well. Keep it coming!!! And as far as pissing on my parade, don't worry bout it. My parade is still a bare frame with boxes upon boxes of parts laying around hahaha... And on an ending note, I cannot believe a banshee owner suggested that I trade it for a 4 stroke, you should be ashamed... Are you done on your soap box? Good.... Spend 2500 to 4000 on a banshee...then spend another 2K to make it even compete with a newer (no...not 8 K brand new) 4 stroke for what you want to do. Sounds like a winner.... No one said you can't make (I should say...detune) a banshee a good trail machine. A box stock 450 from 2004 or newer is better, out of the box...bone stock. Period. Yeah, I know it's a banshee site. You see my bike in my sig pic, don't you? I'm just a realist who keeps my ego in check and has a sense of reality....that's all.... Why do things the hard way when you can do things the smart way? So based on your reasoning, I just should go and buy a newer muscle car...and convert it to 4 wheel drive to mod bog in. I mean...essentially, that's what you're saying....you want to be so different. Carry on.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSSA Posted August 30, 2007 Report Share Posted August 30, 2007 I am trying to remember when I told you where those pipes started making power and what kind of numbers they made. I am trying to remember where I said that you needed to provide a dyno graph for me to say that it's not producing high torque #s down low. Oh wait--I didn't. A big single (500cc) two-stroke is going to make *SOME* low-end torque. However, in the bigger scheme of things, it's still not going to compare to a large-bore 4-stroke in that department. Once again, it's all subjective (I guess some people consider 8000rpms "low rpms"). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigblockbanshee Posted August 31, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2007 I'm not on a soap box dude, I'm just explaining how I feel about it plain and simple. As far as the part about being different. Isn't that what it's all about? I mean come on, who wants to have the exact same thing that someone else has? I'm not getting uptight I'm just trying to justify my reasoning. And if my reasoning still isn't explained or justified then that's fine. This is a forum, it's made for discussion and opposing opinions. That's how you get things explained and worked out and stuff like that. In my opinion, I hate the way a 4 stroke sounds. Even with a quiet stock exhaust your constantly getting deafened by the obnoxious sound. Again, just my opinion... To me theres nothing like being in the woods or on the track and hearing a well tuned 2 stroke hitting the powerband. AHHHHH. Anyway, I just think a 4 stroke is too monotonous. The tone never changes, just the rpms. I love the power of a 4 stroke though. There's no denying that a 2 stroke will never trump a 4 stroke when it comes to torque. My goal is to try to get as much torque as I can and to make it as trail-friendly as I can. No one ever said they were trying to make more torque than a thumping 4 stroke. I'm planning on going to a taller gear because as I said earlier, I could care less what it runs on top end because it is hard to find something that outperforms a banshee in top speed. Because I'm restoring and reusing most of the stock parts I'll probably have between $2500 and 3000 in it when it is finally ready to ride. I'm doing all the work myself so that's gonna save a ton. It's not gonna be a contender, powerhouse, or whatever you wanna call it, just your ordinary nice looking, decent running banshee. Keep in mind, this is only my 2nd 2 stroke and my first banshee so I've got a lot to learn. But like I said, I just wanna make it torquey so it'll be more trail friendly and in turn be more easy to learn to ride for me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajogejr Posted August 31, 2007 Report Share Posted August 31, 2007 Fair enough, I had a few beers in me last night, probably was a little too brash... I am 100% with you on the sound...they are fucking obnoxious....and they just don't sound the same at 10K RPM as a twin two stroke...AMEN. Really...my point is, out of the box, any newer 4 stroke, 400EX and 400 Suzuki included, are better suited for trails motor and suspension -wise.... Does the 2500 to 3K include suspension upgrades? If so...it'll be a fun ride.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2004LEBanshee Posted August 31, 2007 Report Share Posted August 31, 2007 drop the front tooth one or two. it will feel more torquey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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