KaN Powersports

What's weird to me is you listed the problem in the first post. You tied red/black to black/white and grounded them. Red/black gets grounded, and the black/white does not (It gets grounded to kill the bike). Did you repair this not knowing and change the CDI at the same time? Tricking you into thinking it was the CDI. Anyway glad to see she is up and running.....

^^^^Wouldn't surprise me! And I'll bet it doesn't last as long as a properly set-up 'shee engine either.... It runs though-no denying that

I've always had great luck with T5's. From stock to pretty aggressive stock ported cylinders, increased compression, and timing- they are a GREAT play bike pipe. My wife's play bike has FMF's (they came on it), and we haven't felt the need to change those out either-less aggressive porting, but another great play set-up for duning. If I were shopping for you, you'd get T5's..... Nothing beats a wide powerband when it comes to trails, and dunes (play bikes).... Peak power is second area of interest, you can make all the power in the world, but if it's too peaky, or ill-timed riding isn't as satisfying.

For the elevation difference you listed you'd be similar enough that if you bought a jet variety around your lower elevation range, you'll be covered. So start with the richer choice, and back off from there. If you are still not sure start for at sea level and back off from there. Jets are like 4 each, give or take. So for 60 bucks, you can by like 7-8 changes worth!! That would translate to 320,310,290,280,270,260,250,240 (as an example) That's a huge range to cover vs. somebody's 'jet kit'

Some very valid points there...For comparison's sake: For tight budget sake- 1-my labor on a O/H 150, Pro X rods about 90 ea, std. bearings about 150-rounded up of course, a long rod crank=480 (Quality parts) Blaster pistons (cast) about 90 ea cutting stock head 50. Stock long rod=230 + 480= 710.00 2- Hot Rods 4 mil 425-welded 450 pistons 130 ea cutting stock head 50 porting 300 (spacer-or not) for the sake of putting it on here spacer plate ??30 (I don't even know what they cost-haha I make mine when needed)... (This would be a budget oriented 4mill-of course) Hot Rods basic 4mil=1090-1115 I agree about trueing and welding the crank and start the game with a quality port job and set of matching pipes-They'd be needed for either mod anyway There are a lot of variations that would affect both of these, but they both would run better than stock, and when pinching pennies, 380.00 dollars is a lot of gas and oil

^^^^^That's right

n2otoofast4u has a very valid point. It is an educated situation to know where you are being excessive, and where the extra expense is mandatory. Cast pistons are just fine for stockish engines (what came in it in the first place). If you start down the road of making it 'bigger, badder, faster', your parts selection WILL have to follow suit. To answer your question, on a good piston you measure it's OD about 1/4-1/2 inch up from the bottom on the skirt, and you measure the bore. Subtract the two findings and that's your wall clearance. When you are dealing with a range of .001-.005 you need to be somewhat accurate for this. Difficult to do with vernier calipers but achievable. Measure over and over until you get 'repeatability''. Calipers will be useless in determining if it is an out of round, or tapered bore. A bore gauge is needed for this level of accuracy.

^^^I don't disagree. Just pointing out that dollar for dollar you get more out of a 2 I have built a lot of 4's as well. I sponsor 2 MX riders for our area, and they are both 4's (Our 3rd racer is on a 2) All of them run well, and not one of the riders finished the season's series under 2nd place. I have turbocharged Raptors for people as well. The 4's have been coming a long way, and are competitive, and are among us like it or not .... I agree about the over and over part-so much so, that you have spelled it out for us! You can buy a stroke crank in about any size, production mono-blocks, about any dome conceivable, and with a pocket full of change there's a 10mil sitting in every garage! But I see this in the 4's now as well-so much so, that China is puking parts out to us left and right. Whole lot of absolute garbage for pennies on the dollar! Innovation has gone backward, pride has gone down hill, and there is a pretty chromed 'time bomb' in the back of every trailer-so to speak!! Modifying is where my heart is, and just bolting together a bunch of "over-the-counter" parts to make a modded bike IS the reason there is so much misconception, and false information rolling around out there about the basics and physics of a thing as simple as an internal combustion engine. But the punchline is to this whole thing for me is to Have Fun and Enjoy Doing it!!!! Very good point RagunCajun-and, in short, I couldn't agree more-

You can easily put 3000-3500 into the crank, rod, and piston alone! Another 1500 into cams and head, The standard pricing on frame/ clutch set-up. Dollar for dollar, you can go faster on a Banshee.... But it's all in what you like. 4's are getting faster and faster by the minute. But I personally still love the 2!! .....

I think (speculation) one of the reasons Wiseco changed their recommended clearances was to stay competitive. With a Nikasil/cast piston combo, we started seeing the clearances tighten up to as much as .0005 (a half a thousandth of an inch)! I have mine in my play bike (cast piston in a stock cylinder) at .0015. Forged does expand farther than cast, and the holds it's dimension longer than cast under same temp. Therefore, the initial clearance needs to be compensated for (Main reason for cold seizing-it's pretty loose until warmed up). Cast has earned a bad rep for this reason! It just isn't logical to a seasoned engine builder that when warmed up a 0 tolerance, or in some cases 'interference' fit is acceptable. Then when the cast piston is set to an age old-accepted clearance, the skirts get broken off of them from being too loose in the bore!! Forged pistons are about the worst option imaginable in a sled engine-I have seen them seize with the engine shut off during a soda break! Especially in an aluminum/ plated bore. So, in an attempt to stay on this curve, Wiseco engineers step in and claim the same piston that used to be run at, say, .003 can now be set up at .002. That's where the trouble begins! They haven't changed the piston, just the set-up specs, and it is proving to be not as reliable. Like I stated earlier, I have added a bit of clearance to their 'new' numbers and have had great luck. Pistons machined out of solid billet (CP) do not expand as far as 'power forging', so again, I believe Wiseco is just fudging numbers a bit to stay comparative.. Keep in mind this IS just my personal opinion the matter, but has served me well..... But, as I stated earlier, in the case of the piston above. It looks to me, by one pic to go off of, that the particular piston was too tight in the bore.

Using piston stop method (I modified a sparkplug with a long bolt through it's center) and a degree wheel, set up for TDC on one cylinder, not bumping the wheel or pointer at all! Set up the piston stop in the other cylinder and rotate the engine around, and referring to 180 on the wheel compare the phasing (120 for triples). There are tons of forum info, and youtube info on using a degree wheel. For those of you who have never used a degree wheel-but it is very simple and accurate. Piston stop method eliminates any play variables in the engine assembly (bearings and what-not).... You don't even have to tear down your engine for this proceedure, other than removing the flywheel.

With every thing that has already been posted-The bottom line is (to me) It would be the best 'controlled' situation for making a comparison. There are sooo many variables to an engine that the door is definitely opened for endless debate! However, taking one engine and fitting a ton of pipes to it can help narrow the characteristics of each pipe. I liked what was posted earlier about leaving the power numbers off and just graphing the overlays. The valid point to all of (to me) this is to be able to see 'physical' characteristics of the pipes. If you actually know/have the characteristics of your build, (everything included) Then with these donated dyno services, you can (hopefully) get your dollars worth; most for the money, out of a pipe choice. Without doing the reverse engineering on the pipe in question, I would put more stock into what is to come out of this Dyno day than any of the ambiguous posts that have been posted over and over again!! "My pipe is the best-FTW. When I bought it and changed from Brand X, I could ride to the moon in 2nd gear!!" Phooey on that crap!!! I'm curious to see how all of this unfolds!! Bottom line, I think everyone should just thank Cam & Tyler for offering up their time and services publicly-In my opinion, take it for what it's worth-take it or leave it, but unless you have a more valid input, or test day, STFU and be appreciative of the donated service!!! BTW, whether they are accurate (Dyno vs. real world) numbers or not this would be a very useful baseline. They could choose a different angle and take just ONE pipe and modify the engine around it and make a book of different results! Then we could open the 20 page debate for who's porting/build configuration is the best!!!

^^^^^Killer answer for him

The trade offs are (for what it's worth); Long rod increases leverage a bit, and the stock stroke revs out quicker. The stroker engine makes more power but is more complicated to get it right. The long rod can be set up quite inexpensive in comparison. The spacer plate is a bad idea because the piston goes lower than the ports at BDC (and this is worsened with a spacer plate) causing both timing and flow issues. The stock ports are nowhere near ideal for the bore/stroke combo. To do a stock cylinder stroker correctly you have to; 1-have the domes/stock head cut to accommodate the extra stroke 2-Port the cylinders to correct both timing and area to match the new configuration. 3- Modify the intake and transfer port tunnels to accommodate both the new porting, and the new bore/stroke combo. The long rod set-up consists of building the crank with 115 rods, and porting is more of an option, not a requirement. It will run better than stock, and is great place to start. It can be done quite cheaply in comparison to other builds. The biggest trade off begins with your budget mainly. If money were no issue at all, than the sky is the limit and the options are just as limitless.

That piston is seized all of the way around it. It was either too tight of wall clearance, no oil, or you had a coolant leak. For the intake side to gall like that so soon I'd lay bet's on tight wall clearance. Wiseco has 'tightened' up the tolerances listed on their boxes (pistons that used to be specified for .003 clearance all of the sudden started coming saying .002)-I followed suit and had a few immediate failures-so I started adding .0005-.001 to their specs, depending on bore size, and have been fine since.

The phasing should be checked on every crank install. Welded one of, course shouldn't need to be worried about, but I see plenty that are welded out of phase. The phasing is a real common problem on the bigger bore, or higher compression engines-(hence the reason for welding them up in the first place). I had a Skidoo 800 in here last year that had a shaved head, a dome piston in place of the original flat top, and had about 195 psi of cranking compression. It detonated, and the PTO side spun a complete 180 and was inline with the Mag side (by 3 degrees). The customer rode it out like this-hahaha..... I just hope we were able to help with Apeik's problem-sounds like he has fought this for quite some time

Glad to help-hope it's solved for you

Yea, Finch. I wouldn't trust my front end to SST. Plus HEAVY....

Naw, nothing I own runs good-haha I make my own swingers and a-arms. My duner is just a stocker

Damn! I've been doing it wrong. I've been using titanium-I guess I should have studied more-haha

LA Sleeve shouldn't be any hotter than a stock one. The only place that would apply is if it were an aluminum cylinder (Nikasil).. Then they wouldn't be boring it in the first place:).. Check your tune. Now, with all of that said there are situations where this applies-Like the thicker skirt repair sleeve for the lt 250r, or the sleeve inside a sleeve on the CR 500- I do a LOT of resleeving, and I have to say it's not the sleeve's fault your cylinder is running hot

^^^^LOL

Cool, Trick..... Let us know-thanks

Thanks joshb....

Oh man! I can't wait that long-hahaha And I'm not even the one buying it yet .......