Looking for PJ guru's

[Walms]

Hey guys, I'm new to the forum. I came here because I'm using Keihin 34mm PJ's on my Kawasaki triple and can't seem to find anyone on those boards with much experience working with PJ's.

I'm running BGM needles 155 mains 35 pilots and #6 slides.

Right now I think I have this dialed in pretty close 1/4 through to WFO but still having difficulty to get a decent idle. It wants to idle too low, I'd prefer to be around 1500 rpm but it's closer to 700-1000 and a bit laboured. Ajusting the idle and air screw doesn't seem to help much. I'm considering buying #7 slides unless there is a quick mod with the die grinder you guys can recommend? At $40 a pop, I don't wantt to experiment like I have with brass pieces...lol

Here is a pic of the ole girl... She's not a Banshee but at least she's a 2 stroke!

Thanks in advance

 

[Walms]

Just another thought... has anyone tried modding the pilot jets to flow less then the 35's? That might be another route for me as well.

[sleeper06]

I dont know about modding a jet smaller,have you tried syncing the carbs with a vacuum guage($15).It will idle weird if the carbs are not synced up,just a thought.35 pilot is as small as they come for those carbs

[Walms]

I dont know about modding a jet smaller,have you tried syncing the carbs with a vacuum guage($15).It will idle weird if the carbs are not synced up,just a thought.35 pilot is as small as they come for those carbs

 

 

Yup, carbs all sync'd using a unisyn. I've been making up for the lack of smaller pilots by increasing the diameter of the needle.

It seems to be working out ok but a slow and expensive exercise so far!

There is something to be said for mikuni carbs that use an adjustable slide stop for idle.. The mechanical solution is soooo simple

I've read somewhere that these type of carbs idle poorly at the best of times, is this really true?

[camatv]

because of the pj's total bullshit idle circuit it is hard to get them to idle right you may have to go to an even smaller needle OR sell the carbs and buy a set of lectrons or kehien pwk's..

 

have you raised the idle adjust all the way up? you might be able to TRY drilling the idle circuit to flow more air. i have never done that so i'm not sure if it would work i think you could step up the tube through the choke knob. i'd have to look at one to see if its possible. i have a few in the garage all torn apart..

 

you could also try to install an idle screw on the slide or if you dare try to use the cable to do it but i'd think that to be a last resort with the cable.

 

thats a cool ole h-2? there!!

[wesw]

tighten the choke knob down all the way then back them off 9 full turns.

 

start the bike it should idle probably high idle

 

sync the carbs at idle with your thinger

 

mark the position of the knobs and then adjust equally up or down till it idles decent.

 

 

then open your air screw up to like 1.5 turns

 

rev it up if it is slow to rev up adjust more or less air screw till it revs up quickly

 

if you get more then 3 turns on your air screw put a smaller pilot in

 

if you close it put a large pilot in.

 

 

 

ive had good luck with dek needles on my pjs when i had them.

 

 

 

if you were close to ks i would have then dialed in about an hour there good carbs just may cant spend the time to adjust them.

 

but have to have the right needle to start with.

[bigborebanshee]

The main thing you have to understand with the PJ is the relationship between the pilot and idle.Mine would not idle with 9 clicks out but idled great at about 25 and #52 pilots.I was able to fine tune with the airscrews at that point.

 

When I dropped the pilots to 50 trying to clear up a low to mid stumble,I had to back the idle/choke knob to 18 clicks out before I could get a clean idle by fine tuning the airscrews.

 

Set your airscrews to 1.5 turns out..Set your idle/choke knobs to 8-9 clicks out.If the bike refuses to idle at all keep increasing the idle clicks 3-4 per side

untill it runs on its own.Allow about 10 seconds between adjustments to allow the carb circuits to catch up.

 

As a general rule if your engines best idle is less than 5 clicks out or over 40,you probably need to change the pilot jet.Its best if you leave the air screw set at 1.5 out as this will add a variable that will throw you off.save the aircrew adj untill you have established a decent idle within the parameters of the idle adj.

[cactusted]

Have you figured it out yet? Sorry just caught this post...will give you steps on Monday. Sorry to make you wait but I gotta run. 1st, some questions I didn't see anybody ask you. What is your elevation, temperature, exhaust mods, airbox mods, porting, find specs for stock pilot, needle & main. From this info we can establish stock baseline & adjustments needed. Small tip for now...only use idle/choke knob to fine tune. Once carbs are synched, use the main throttle cable adjustment at your throttle to find idle.

[bigborebanshee]

Have you figured it out yet? Sorry just caught this post...will give you steps on Monday. Sorry to make you wait but I gotta run. 1st, some questions I didn't see anybody ask you. What is your elevation, temperature, exhaust mods, airbox mods, porting, find specs for stock pilot, needle & main. From this info we can establish stock baseline & adjustments needed. Small tip for now...only use idle/choke knob to fine tune. Once carbs are synched, use the main throttle cable adjustment at your throttle to find idle.

 

 

You NEVER use the main throttle cable to adjust the Idle,don't listen to this tool!

[cactusted]

Walms...This is why many people switch or stop using forums. Some folks tend to get Computer Balls since they have the ability to be anonymous. I like many in here are not experts but have learned a lot from the more emotionally stable guys in here.. I wasn't aware that a slight adjustment to your throttle cable on a PJ was a cardinal sin. From what you described it seems like you have a decent understanding of lean & rich & how the circuits work with each other. Ask yourself a few questions. If you have a certain pilot & have your choke opened up too much and you supposedly have a good idle, why would you lean out your pilot when you obviously were having to make up for a lean pilot by richening your choke adjust? If your choke is open too much and it's running good then you would put a larger pilot, enabling you to close your choke adjust & maintain the same air/fuel mix. If the needle is the primary circuit for midrange, then why change the pilot for a midrange issue? If a "normal" carb has a mechanical idle adjust (screw)...isn't adjusting your idle merely pushing your slide up? Why would a slight pull on your slide from the other end be a substantial no no? Also, if you synch a PJ by adjusting the throttle cable at the cap, why would adjusting the other end "slightly" be a substantial problem? Also, when tuning your idle circuit you use the air screw to gauge your pilot size...not the other way around. You open your air screw until you reach max idle. I then back mine off 1/8 turn. If it is open more than 1.5-2 turns than put a smaller pilot. If open less than 1 turn than try larger pilot. It shouldn't take you too long too find step by step jetting instructions in here to verify this process. You shouldn't just keep throwing jets/$$$ at it when your air screw will tell you exactly what you need. I do agree that if your choke/idle is opened too much then you need a different pilot (larger) & I do agree that your throttle cable shouldn't be your primary idle adjustment. I'm sure there are some actual gurus in here that may agree with "mr happy" about adjusting your cable. I definately think you need to do a proper tune 1st. Without knowing any Kawasaki oem mods to your PJ's, other mods & elevation and temp...the best anybody can do is give general advice and tips. Being as a 35 pilot is as small as you can go...unless you are running at 6000' + elevation & 90+ degs, it's probably too small to begin with. If at sea-1000' & 70deg you should probably be around stock, probably 1 size smaller & go from there. Higher elevations/warmer climates = smaller jets to match your thinner air & lower elevations/cooler climates = larger jets to match the more dense air. It's hard to tell from this side of the computer but it sounds like you may need to start closer to stock & tune with airscrew from there. Stock PJ specs are 152main / 55pilot / CEGneedle & 16mm float height. Your pilot & needle are substantially leaner than this but I have know idea if Kawasaki modified these for your bike. 1 last thing, if your 34mm PJs were not the stock size carbs then you'll have a hell of a time adjusting them enough to get an idle. Don't trust everything others say or me either since some rocket scientist called me a "tool". There's enough advise on here to prove things out & make sure it makes sense before you do it.

Edited October 11, 2010 by cactusted